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	<title>Comments on: The Fundamental Axiom of Experience</title>
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	<link>http://www.sidfaiwu.com/blog/index.php/2010/01/the-fundamental-axiom-of-experience/</link>
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		<title>By: ????</title>
		<link>http://www.sidfaiwu.com/blog/index.php/2010/01/the-fundamental-axiom-of-experience/comment-page-1/#comment-54127</link>
		<dc:creator>????</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Aug 2012 04:11:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sidfaiwu.com/blog/?p=971#comment-54127</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[thanks for the&#039;s post]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>thanks for the&#8217;s post</p>
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		<title>By: beritakpop</title>
		<link>http://www.sidfaiwu.com/blog/index.php/2010/01/the-fundamental-axiom-of-experience/comment-page-1/#comment-54122</link>
		<dc:creator>beritakpop</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Aug 2012 02:50:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[The best experience IMO is that you gained from others than from yourself.. Its the quickest way..]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The best experience IMO is that you gained from others than from yourself.. Its the quickest way..</p>
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		<title>By: sidfaiwu</title>
		<link>http://www.sidfaiwu.com/blog/index.php/2010/01/the-fundamental-axiom-of-experience/comment-page-1/#comment-28045</link>
		<dc:creator>sidfaiwu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Jan 2010 00:25:23 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[Thanks, Kansas Bob.  I&#039;m glad I offered something you found helpful.

I guess it does make sense, Sawaz, that induction is fundamental to other animals&#039; experience of the world as well.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks, Kansas Bob.  I&#8217;m glad I offered something you found helpful.</p>
<p>I guess it does make sense, Sawaz, that induction is fundamental to other animals&#8217; experience of the world as well.</p>
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		<title>By: Sawaz</title>
		<link>http://www.sidfaiwu.com/blog/index.php/2010/01/the-fundamental-axiom-of-experience/comment-page-1/#comment-28031</link>
		<dc:creator>Sawaz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Jan 2010 01:51:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sidfaiwu.com/blog/?p=971#comment-28031</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hello Sid Here is a spin on induction I haven&#039;t heard before and that is it&#039;s evolutionary basis.Induction isn&#039;t only prevalent in human existence but it seems positively supreme in the animal kingdom!
Learning by experience without understanding the whys of a circumstance basically determines the daily lives of all animals. I doubt if there is very much in the way of deduction going on in the animal kingdom and many times it doesn&#039;t seem like much is happening in human society either. One can probably say that for basically all animals for hundreds of millions of years and if true and it seems to me to make sense then induction must be a very economical way of allowing it&#039;s host to survive.
From this I think we can conclude that life on other planets if it has a way of sensing their world and there is no reason they shouldn&#039;t will also employ induction.It seems the neural net known as the brain is the most efficient method known to weigh sensory inputs and induction is built right in.
That doesn&#039;t mean induction will always be around but it certainly points in that direction.
Of course  one can exploit this powerful trait like when people chum animals or magicians do something which is beyond our normal inductive experience.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello Sid Here is a spin on induction I haven&#8217;t heard before and that is it&#8217;s evolutionary basis.Induction isn&#8217;t only prevalent in human existence but it seems positively supreme in the animal kingdom!<br />
Learning by experience without understanding the whys of a circumstance basically determines the daily lives of all animals. I doubt if there is very much in the way of deduction going on in the animal kingdom and many times it doesn&#8217;t seem like much is happening in human society either. One can probably say that for basically all animals for hundreds of millions of years and if true and it seems to me to make sense then induction must be a very economical way of allowing it&#8217;s host to survive.<br />
From this I think we can conclude that life on other planets if it has a way of sensing their world and there is no reason they shouldn&#8217;t will also employ induction.It seems the neural net known as the brain is the most efficient method known to weigh sensory inputs and induction is built right in.<br />
That doesn&#8217;t mean induction will always be around but it certainly points in that direction.<br />
Of course  one can exploit this powerful trait like when people chum animals or magicians do something which is beyond our normal inductive experience.</p>
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		<title>By: Kansas Bob</title>
		<link>http://www.sidfaiwu.com/blog/index.php/2010/01/the-fundamental-axiom-of-experience/comment-page-1/#comment-28030</link>
		<dc:creator>Kansas Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Jan 2010 00:08:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sidfaiwu.com/blog/?p=971#comment-28030</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I used that Einstein quote this afternoon.. one of my favorites. I also liked this thought and found it helpful Sid: &quot;It cannot be proven by experiencing reality, but can be used to understand our experience of reality.&quot;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I used that Einstein quote this afternoon.. one of my favorites. I also liked this thought and found it helpful Sid: &#8220;It cannot be proven by experiencing reality, but can be used to understand our experience of reality.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: sidfaiwu</title>
		<link>http://www.sidfaiwu.com/blog/index.php/2010/01/the-fundamental-axiom-of-experience/comment-page-1/#comment-28006</link>
		<dc:creator>sidfaiwu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Jan 2010 21:38:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sidfaiwu.com/blog/?p=971#comment-28006</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;I would feel like I was doing you a disservice if I didn’t find something to question.&quot;

Thanks Snurp!  I wish I could return that favor more often but your area of philosophy is one I don&#039;t know enough about to question with any competency.

Yes, I am playing a bit fast and loose with terminology in this post.  The reason for that is because I&#039;m trying to keep my blog posts short (for me).  That means I had to &lt;a href = &quot;http://thesnurp.blogspot.com/2009/12/clarity-contra-simplicity.html&quot; target = &quot;_blank&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;sacrifice some clarity for simplicity&lt;/a&gt;.

My favorite philosophers have, for the most part, been empiricist so I guess it&#039;s fair to apply the label to myself as well.  Reality may well be more than our structured experiences, as you put it, but our structured experiences are all of reality that we can know with any certainty.  This is why I used our &#039;experience of reality&#039; instead of just &#039;reality&#039;.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I would feel like I was doing you a disservice if I didn’t find something to question.&#8221;</p>
<p>Thanks Snurp!  I wish I could return that favor more often but your area of philosophy is one I don&#8217;t know enough about to question with any competency.</p>
<p>Yes, I am playing a bit fast and loose with terminology in this post.  The reason for that is because I&#8217;m trying to keep my blog posts short (for me).  That means I had to <a href = "http://thesnurp.blogspot.com/2009/12/clarity-contra-simplicity.html" target = "_blank" rel="nofollow">sacrifice some clarity for simplicity</a>.</p>
<p>My favorite philosophers have, for the most part, been empiricist so I guess it&#8217;s fair to apply the label to myself as well.  Reality may well be more than our structured experiences, as you put it, but our structured experiences are all of reality that we can know with any certainty.  This is why I used our &#8216;experience of reality&#8217; instead of just &#8216;reality&#8217;.</p>
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		<title>By: Snurp</title>
		<link>http://www.sidfaiwu.com/blog/index.php/2010/01/the-fundamental-axiom-of-experience/comment-page-1/#comment-27997</link>
		<dc:creator>Snurp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Jan 2010 20:50:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sidfaiwu.com/blog/?p=971#comment-27997</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I would feel like I was doing you a disservice if I didn&#039;t find something to question.  Let&#039;s see what I can do here.

That induction is important in experiencing reality is difficult to argue with.  You might be saying something else, though, when you say that it &quot;serves as a starting point for or experience of reality.&quot;  It seems to me that this is somewhat different from the question of reality.  I think there may be some muddle here between &quot;experience&quot; and &quot;reality,&quot; and I think that could have unclear consequences.

Also, I&#039;m not sure how exactly to take the idea that induction is fundamental.  Is there anything besides experience that has a hand in establishing reality, so to speak?  Or does it exist as a law of sorts beforehand?  If you are an empiricist (which of course Hume was, and which you definitely seem to be, and which many professional philosophers are), then you may not think so.  If reality is nothing more than the structured experiences we have, then this seems right.  But I&#039;m not sure it quite gets to reality as such, or, I should say, to the whole of it.

I&#039;m going to take a pseudo-Kantian angle here.  I recall you once mentioning long ago that you had read the &lt;i&gt;Critique of Pure Reason&lt;/i&gt;, but didn&#039;t find it too memorable.  In a sense, that book was a response to Hume.  Kant had a rationalist tendency throughout his life, but was seriously perturbed by Hume&#039;s arguments (“&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.mnstate.edu/gracyk/courses/phil%20306/kant_materials/prolegomena1.htm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;I openly confess, the suggestion of David Hume was the very thing, which many years ago first interrupted my dogmatic slumber, and gave my investigations in the field of speculative philosophy quite a new direction.&lt;/a&gt;”)  Kant felt that Hume raised challenging questions but failed to give sufficient explanations; induction and association may explain why we act in certain ways and experience certain things, but they don’t explain reality, existence as such, part of the problem being of course that such psychological explanations are based on the world of experience (thus an understanding of the world) already.  The result is that, to put it in your terms, if induction is an axiom (I don&#039;t recall Kant&#039;s exact position, and I don&#039;t want to screw it up), it&#039;s not the primary one.  What those primary axioms actually are is what Kant delves into, and the course of metaphysics afterwards has been strongly affected by him, however indirectly (and less so in English-speaking philosophy, which was probably more strongly affected by Hume).

Now, your post was titled &quot;The Fundamental Axiom of &lt;i&gt;Experience&lt;/i&gt;,&quot; so if you were only referring to experience itself, then I&#039;m not sure how much all of this helps.  In ordinary experience, we do treat induction with something like the status you give it.  Not just in obvious examples of cause and effect, either: a Humean could explain an object as a consistent grouping of properties that, as a collective, comes to be identified over time (and &lt;i&gt;through experience&lt;/i&gt;) as a thing, a one with many properties.  It&#039;s an axiom we all abide by.  But to call it a fundamental axiom, as though it&#039;s prior to all others, I&#039;m not sure of.  As to the equating of reality and experience, I&#039;m not sure from your post whether you are doing that, so feel free to clear that up.  As for me, oh dear too many words should stop talking now.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would feel like I was doing you a disservice if I didn&#8217;t find something to question.  Let&#8217;s see what I can do here.</p>
<p>That induction is important in experiencing reality is difficult to argue with.  You might be saying something else, though, when you say that it &#8220;serves as a starting point for or experience of reality.&#8221;  It seems to me that this is somewhat different from the question of reality.  I think there may be some muddle here between &#8220;experience&#8221; and &#8220;reality,&#8221; and I think that could have unclear consequences.</p>
<p>Also, I&#8217;m not sure how exactly to take the idea that induction is fundamental.  Is there anything besides experience that has a hand in establishing reality, so to speak?  Or does it exist as a law of sorts beforehand?  If you are an empiricist (which of course Hume was, and which you definitely seem to be, and which many professional philosophers are), then you may not think so.  If reality is nothing more than the structured experiences we have, then this seems right.  But I&#8217;m not sure it quite gets to reality as such, or, I should say, to the whole of it.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m going to take a pseudo-Kantian angle here.  I recall you once mentioning long ago that you had read the <i>Critique of Pure Reason</i>, but didn&#8217;t find it too memorable.  In a sense, that book was a response to Hume.  Kant had a rationalist tendency throughout his life, but was seriously perturbed by Hume&#8217;s arguments (“<a href="http://www.mnstate.edu/gracyk/courses/phil%20306/kant_materials/prolegomena1.htm" rel="nofollow">I openly confess, the suggestion of David Hume was the very thing, which many years ago first interrupted my dogmatic slumber, and gave my investigations in the field of speculative philosophy quite a new direction.</a>”)  Kant felt that Hume raised challenging questions but failed to give sufficient explanations; induction and association may explain why we act in certain ways and experience certain things, but they don’t explain reality, existence as such, part of the problem being of course that such psychological explanations are based on the world of experience (thus an understanding of the world) already.  The result is that, to put it in your terms, if induction is an axiom (I don&#8217;t recall Kant&#8217;s exact position, and I don&#8217;t want to screw it up), it&#8217;s not the primary one.  What those primary axioms actually are is what Kant delves into, and the course of metaphysics afterwards has been strongly affected by him, however indirectly (and less so in English-speaking philosophy, which was probably more strongly affected by Hume).</p>
<p>Now, your post was titled &#8220;The Fundamental Axiom of <i>Experience</i>,&#8221; so if you were only referring to experience itself, then I&#8217;m not sure how much all of this helps.  In ordinary experience, we do treat induction with something like the status you give it.  Not just in obvious examples of cause and effect, either: a Humean could explain an object as a consistent grouping of properties that, as a collective, comes to be identified over time (and <i>through experience</i>) as a thing, a one with many properties.  It&#8217;s an axiom we all abide by.  But to call it a fundamental axiom, as though it&#8217;s prior to all others, I&#8217;m not sure of.  As to the equating of reality and experience, I&#8217;m not sure from your post whether you are doing that, so feel free to clear that up.  As for me, oh dear too many words should stop talking now.</p>
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		<title>By: Scott Roche</title>
		<link>http://www.sidfaiwu.com/blog/index.php/2010/01/the-fundamental-axiom-of-experience/comment-page-1/#comment-27994</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott Roche</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Jan 2010 18:02:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sidfaiwu.com/blog/?p=971#comment-27994</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hmmm.  I think that&#039;s valid.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmmm.  I think that&#8217;s valid.</p>
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